28 Sep 2015 15:26:03
Tampa Trades
Stamkos
2nd Round Pick 2016

Toronto Trades
Bozak
Gauthier (AHL)
Percy (AHL)
1st Round Pick 2016 (Leafs Pick)
3rd Round Pick 2016 (Pens Pick)

Tampa has Cap Issues.
Stamkos doesn't seem interested in resigning.
Stamkos from the Toronto area and the Leafs Mangement doing it the right way, Stamkos I believe wants to come home and be part of what the Leafs are doing.
This is the type of Trade Leaf Nation craves.
Stamkos with his age and Talent is still a rebuild Trade.

I am sure I will get ripped as usual but if you look at both Teams including Cap and Stamkos not signed is it really that unrealistic?

Thoughts?

1.) 28 Sep 2015
28 Sep 2015 17:07:34
yup, more logical insight from pinball. totally believable.

2.) 28 Sep 2015
28 Sep 2015 17:39:21
Shankar and Chirp to name a few on here still don't get Salary Cap.
Its not always about Talent the NHL is a Cap Business like it or not.

Tampa still has to sign Emery as there backup Goaltender and are over the Cap by 1.5 million or so, plus if they want to Trade for help during the Season they are up against the Cap.

3.) 28 Sep 2015
28 Sep 2015 18:08:41
oh, I'm quit certain I understadn the salary cap. moreso than you anyways.

you're probably not taking ohlund going on ltir into consideration, so there is the equivalent of probably 5 emery contracts.

i don't care to look further into their cap situation, but you also likely do not understand that the cap hits are pro-rated over the course of the season. let's say TB wants to trade for someone with a 5 mil original cap hit at the deadline, at the 65-70 game mark that 5 mil will be under 1 mil against their cap for the remainder of the season. my point here being that as you move further into the season a small amount of cap room can become a rather significant addition at the deadline.

4.) 28 Sep 2015
28 Sep 2015 18:20:09
Not even close.

5.) 28 Sep 2015
28 Sep 2015 19:30:04
This trade is ridiculous. No need to try and argue that.

@Shankar

You are way off on that cap hit idea you brainstormed up.

A cap hit is a cap hit, no matter what time of the year. Someone who has a 5 million cap hit at the beginning of the year will have a 5 million dollar cap hit at the end of the year regardless of if they are traded or not. that's just how it is.

However, what I think you may have been eluding at was the actually salary of said player. For example, if a player with a 5 million dollar SALARY (note; not CAP HIT) is traded at the deadline, the team taking on his salary will only have to pay the remaining SALARY on his contract for that year (would probably be ~1 million) and he would still carry his 5 million dollar cap hit onto that team.

Think of it this way, If a contender were to take a run at the cup, why wouldn't they just trade for all these superstars and only pay 1/7th of their cap hit, essentially getting 7 superstars for the price of 1 on their salary cap. It just doesn't make sense. You would see it happen all the time if that were the case.

6.) 28 Sep 2015
28 Sep 2015 19:53:55
Crazier things have happened.

7.) 28 Sep 2015
28 Sep 2015 21:05:46
Bottom line Shankar is this.
Why hasn't Stamkos signed?
Yzerman will only go so far and either take a chance after the Season and watch his #1 Player walk with nothing coming back.
If that happens wouldn't they still be better off with Bozak as your #3 Centre behind TJohnson and Filppula, wouldn't it be better to have Gauthier and Percy in the wings to take over BBoyle and Carle or Corburns roster spot with Cap Space to sign the RFS's, yes they lose the 2nd Round Pick but get the Leafs 1st and Pitts 3rd.
NHL is a business the Wayne Gretzky Trade proved that years ago.
Yes if Stamkos signs what I have posted will never happen but what I am seeing is Stamkos won't sign and would have by now.

8.) 28 Sep 2015
28 Sep 2015 21:18:52
First of all, Emery was released from his PTO.

Second, you really think no other team in the league could and would offer better than that? Even if Stamkos gets traded, which I still say won't happen, why is it you're acting like the only possible place he could end up is Toronto and as a result are posting ludicrous proposals day after day? The value isn't there and neither is your biased tunnel-vision brain.

9.) 28 Sep 2015
28 Sep 2015 21:27:55
Why or just wait till offseason and sign him for free

10.) 28 Sep 2015
28 Sep 2015 21:51:17
@stammer

im right, it can be looked at two ways. either the way I posted it, or the cap inflates as the season goes on, do a few seconds of research instead of talking out of your rear end and you'll figure it out for yourself.

11.) 28 Sep 2015
28 Sep 2015 21:53:42
and to your second point, when have 7 superstars been moved at the deadline? think about it logically and stop spewing garbage. the salary cap is much more complicated than a concrete number.

12.) 28 Sep 2015
28 Sep 2015 22:42:07
Hahaha yeah Shankar and Chirp, God do you Gus even salary cap?

13.) 28 Sep 2015
28 Sep 2015 23:06:42
Tampa is getting nothing descent in return.

14.) 28 Sep 2015
28 Sep 2015 23:35:50
Everyone of your posts are absolute mind boggling Pinball

15.) 29 Sep 2015
28 Sep 2015 23:55:19
When Stamkos is a Leaf all of you will eat you're words.
It will happen if you understand what it is to play in you're hometown for really the most popular Team in the league with the Best Coach in the league there really is no other place he would play, he will never have a money worry so its not about a extra million or so with another Team.
All of you never post anything except how dumb a Trade looks in you're eyes

16.) 29 Sep 2015
29 Sep 2015 03:57:03
pinny!

17.) 29 Sep 2015
29 Sep 2015 04:14:44
@ Shankar

You're clearly not understanding what I wrote. At all.

A players cap hit remains the same all year no matter what. You said that a 5 million dollar cap hit player that is traded at the deadline has his cap hit number drop to under 1 million because the majority of the season is over? that's not true. For example, when Antoine Vermette was traded to the Blackhawks at the deadline last year, he still counted 3.75 M against Chicagos cap. The cap hit never changes unless salary is retained which you never specified.

For my second post, surely you can't be serious. I was talking hypothetically, I never said anyone has every traded for 7 superstars at the deadline, the point I was trying to get across was that if the cap hit worked the way you seem to think it works, then you would be able to acquire 7 players who originally had a 7 million dollar cap hit, because now they are apparently only worth ~1 million each. Which is also not true.

I'll use real players so you can understand my example.

You say that a 5 million dollar player that is traded at the deadline will only count against the cap for 1 million. Therefore, you can get 5 players that were once 5 million, for a grand total of only 5 million against the cap even though you just acquired 25 million dollars worth of players. Example, say James Neal (5M), Brassard (5M), Grabovski (5M), Filppula (5M) and Vrbata (5M) are acquired by one team at the deadline ( I know, it would never happen, but just hear me out) You are saying that Neal, Brassard, Grabo, Flipper and Vrbata would only cost 1 Million EACH against the cap? Therefore, all 5 players would only cost 5 million against the cap, BY YOUR LOGIC. That is the point I was trying to make, which clearly is false. And if this was true, then you would see contenders loading up on high end talent like this while only paying a minimum number against the cap.

So there it is. Hopefully you understand what I was saying and you can stop your childish immature ad hominem attacks and debate like an adult should.

If you can prove to me that what I am saying is incorrect, with actual proof, then I will gladly retract my statements and apologize.

Your move.

18.) 29 Sep 2015
29 Sep 2015 04:19:40
@ Shankar

The league salary cap does not inflate throughout the course of the season. Where did you get that idea?
The new salary cap number is determined in the offseason every year and is to be implemented into the following season. You can;t just change the salary cap midway through the season, that's ridiculous.

19.) 29 Sep 2015
29 Sep 2015 04:22:36
Pinball just stop. If Stamkos goes to Toronto it's because he values playing for his home team over winning. Because he's not going to win there. And Detroit players seemed relieved Babcock left that doesn't really spew confidence for me in terms of player attraction. He can win a cup in Tampa or fade to retirement in Toronto that's his choice. But it doesn't mean tampa needs to take on dead cap in Bozak when they have better cheaper centers and get prospects that could never crack their roster. Only thing of value is the leafs first Bozak has negative value to tampa

20.) 29 Sep 2015
29 Sep 2015 04:24:34
@ Shankar

Exactly, you've never seen 7 superstars traded to one team at the deadline because it wouldn't be possible with the way the cap ACTUALLY works. I was just stating by your logic it would be ABLE to work. Which is clearly bogus.

21.) 29 Sep 2015
29 Sep 2015 09:58:38
I tried to look into it but I didn't want to do to much reading. But I've always thought that @Stammer2Leafs2016 was right. I get that the salary goes down but the cap hit will stay the same no matter how for into the season.

22.) 29 Sep 2015
29 Sep 2015 12:06:40
Take a good look at the Leaf Roster, adding Stamkos probably makes the Leafs a Playoff Team jbs32, where do you get the Detroit Players are relieved Babcock is gone?
Its a loss losing the best Coach in the NHL

23.) 29 Sep 2015
29 Sep 2015 14:08:05
@Stammer @Oilers11 a players cap hit is prorated. Easiest way to put it is each team gets the the cap money over an entire season to spend on their roster. When a player is traded mid season part of their cap has already been attributed to the original team. The acquiring team takes on what is left of the cap for the remainder of the season and the trading team keeps the hit they already spent on the player. That's how Tampa could acquire Coburn last year etc. Most playoff teams only have 1-2 mill of cap room at the start of the year and wouldn't be able to bring anyone in if this wasn't the case

24.) 29 Sep 2015
29 Sep 2015 14:10:56
@ Pinball numerous Detroit players said it was time for a change from Babcock. And I have heard from other places that he isn't a players coach. He's a good coach that has also been handed stacked teams I believe the difference he makes and the amount he adds to Torontos recruiting has been extremely overstated. As for Leafs roster. Ya I have looked at it. They have 1 maybe 2 top 4 defenceman a middle of the pack goalie and with Stamkos 3 top 6 forwards. That's still not a playoff team.

25.) 29 Sep 2015
29 Sep 2015 18:11:26
sometimes I wonder why I try to prove anything on here, no matter how obvious it is.

jbs32, you can take over this one if you want, you clearly understand the way the cap works haha.

26.) 29 Sep 2015
29 Sep 2015 18:57:46
Its a very complicated matter, and I would like to apologize to Shankar since s/he is partially correct. Basically what happens is that a team at the deadline who has say, 2 million in cap space can acquire a player with a 4 million cap hit (if acquired past the midway point of the season) as long as it's only for the remainder of that season. However, their daily cap hit remains the same (4 million); if they stay with that team onward, their cap hit will reflect as 4 million throughout the next year.

27.) 29 Sep 2015
29 Sep 2015 19:09:39
of course it goes back to their original hit at the start of every year, assuming there is more than just the remainder of the season in which they are traded on it. I thought that would have been common sense and that we are debating in season moves.

28.) 29 Sep 2015
29 Sep 2015 21:10:04
Hey Pinball and the rest of maple laughs nation, No one cares about Leaf nation. We have heard all this before and it hasn't happened and it won't. Though you guys are worth a good laugh. Good luck

29.) 29 Sep 2015
29 Sep 2015 23:32:21
I don't agree with this trade at all. As a leaf fan, I want stamkos on our team. I do think Tbay is not going to get a full return for him. Similar to the Kessel trade with only having one trade partner. If stamkos doesn't sign and they ask him to give a list of team, I guarantee he will either say only the leafs and they will hose them or he gives a couple more teams and they don't give anything unless they are pushing for the cup or request to speak with him to negotiate a contract before they pull the trigger.

Now for all the leaf haters that have to jump on every crappy post made by a leaf fan to make themselves feel better. Go jump in a lake because there is no Calgary trade proposals for me to bash because their fans can't compete with the number of fans the leafs have.

30.) 01 Oct 2015
01 Oct 2015 01:35:05
just so were clear

a pro rated cap hit on a player aquired at the trade deadline means:

a 5 million dollar player playing 1/5 of the season (17 games give or take) means 1 million against a teams cap for the rest of that season. I really thought we were smarter than this guys

31.) 01 Oct 2015
01 Oct 2015 09:26:55
Haha I feel dumb I honestly didn't know that. Makes total sense though

32.) 02 Oct 2015
02 Oct 2015 19:47:17
They have a whole season to sign him. Lots of guys who will be moved to give him his pay. He wants to win a cup and frankly it won't happen in Toronto anytime soon. A lot of guys on the Leafs are overpaid and because of that they could sign Stamkos if he hit the open market, but than you will have to address Kadri who needs a new contract. And who is going to fill out the rest of your lines. If you have the majority of your cap in one very good player and a bunch of players who received albatross contracts from Nonis. Teams don't want Bozak, Phaneuf, Robidas, and Lupul because they are overpaid for the role they fill. Bottom line is Stamkos will remain a Bolt. Garrison, Coburn, Carle, Bishop would all be moved to clear cap before they let Stamkos walk.